Is The Government Reflecting The Voter's Choices?
Posted by: MandMm
19th Apr 2011 05:59pm
Just wanted to start a discussion about the current government, and if voters feel that they are reflecting the views of the voters who elected them.
For example, I don't feel that they are listening to what the voters are saying about the Carbon Tax, boat people, climate change, and taxation.
Anyone have any views on this? Also, if you didn't vote for the current government, i'm interested to hear how you feel about their inaction.
For example, I don't feel that they are listening to what the voters are saying about the Carbon Tax, boat people, climate change, and taxation.
Anyone have any views on this? Also, if you didn't vote for the current government, i'm interested to hear how you feel about their inaction.
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Comments 40
mauvehaze
I didn't vote for the current government. Who can say they did? K Rudd was voted in, not JG. I believe in one vote, one party, not the corrupt system of "I'll scratch your back if you scratch mine and give you our preferential votes if you do this when you get in." The Greens got in there with their demands after handing over their preferential votes. No one on a committee elects anyone with preferential votes, it's one vote, one person. My voting paper has a line drawn through the lot and I print "One vote, one party" on it. I do not get fined as I have been to the ballot. I will not vote for such a corrupt system. It needs to be changed before we are listened to by those elected.
Steve49
Tax the mines and the multinationals they can afford it. When the Get Severely Taxed (gst) they received huge tax cuts and the tax burden was placed on the ordinary people. I know that we pensioners received a 2% pay rise to cover an alleged 8% rise, thanks a lot flack jacket johnnie you gutless little worm.
Anonymous
Carbon tax must be paid but the companies that create the most carbon should pay the most tax. Climate change needs to be addresses more seriously. All houses and buildings built from now on should have some kinds of ecologically friendly systems already in place eg: solar panels, recycling water etc. Tax the rich, they can afford it.
chips48
They certainly are not listening to voters, especially pensioners, and they really have no idea how people on low and fixed incomes live. They don't have to worry about where their next feed is coming from, or how they are going to pay their power bill so they can heat their houses or cook a meal. It's time for a change is all I can say, and the sooner the better. As for climate change, it is a complete fairy tale, and nothing is happening today that hasn't happened in the past. All these so-called scientists are doing are giving themselves a reason to exist and receive the high wages they do. 30 years ago we were being told that we were heading for an ice-age, and now we're being told that the world is over-heating and that the seas are going to rise by metres. How come we are having such a cold winter then, and we didn't even have summer here in Hobart.
seesaw
I agree with you,this government,isn't listening to the Australian people,in the Carbon Tax,boat people etc etc,quite frankly,I feel that this government,would be happy to see the sickle and hammer,on our flag instead of the Union Jack.I didn't vote for them.and haven't since Gough Whitham,ran our county into the ground.
dodger
what s going on my father & grandfather fought for this country so that we could have the lifestyle & peace we have all been able to enjoy now there just selling off our country & assetts to the highest bidder is it true illegal imagrants get more than our pensioners when they are invited in at our exspence that 2% of the muslim population seem to make a lot of demands the government needs to look after there own before jumping to attention for all these freeloaders
dodger
what s going on my father & grandfather fought for this country so that we could have the lifestyle & peace we have all been able to enjoy now there just selling off our country & assetts to the highest bidder is it true illegal imagrants get more than our pensioners when they are invited in at our exspence that 2% of the muslim population seem to make a lot of demands the government needs to look after there own before jumping to attention for all these freeloaders
dondo
NO, The people have made it clear, we do not want this carbon tax & don't get me started on this joke "boat people". Pity our Pensioners don't receive half the benefits these ILLIGAL boat people have handed to them. This Government is a bloody disgrace.
tiff2000
Yes, great idea. Tax the people, cut Defence which will give the boat people better access to our shores. Oh wait! We're sending 800 illegal immegrants to Malaysia, paying them for the privilege and taking 4000 supposed asylum seekers from them to resettle them in Australia. Meanwhile, the government tells us we don't have enough water, clean energy or government money for those that already live here.
By the way. Does anyone have a dictionary?
Imogen6
I didn't vote as I'm not an Australian citizen, but having lived here for 81/2 years feel qualified to comment. I pay taxes (payg & gst) being a business owner. I think what a lot of these politicians fail to realise (and I'm talking state, federal and local body) is that they are where they are because of our votes. They signed up for the job using their parties policy manifesto and promised to represent their electorates; and that goes for the independents as well. I guess the independents are in a better situation than most as they don't have hard and fast policies to adhere to, just what they promised their electorate. The rest though are where they are through the voter, and the voters aren't happy or being fairly represented. With the last election neatly tucked away and growing discontent Labour are doing their utmost to distance itself from its previous election promises not to have a carbon tax, to do something about the increasing problem of boat arrivals and increasing taxation to meet their burgening overspending. If the politicians were in any way reflecting the views of the electorate we wouldn't find ourselves in the situation we now find ourselves in and that adds up to around AUD$50 billion in debt. Labour raided the future fund to bankroll the NBN and where has that gotten us? throwing good money after bad with more to come.
The worst thing to come out of the last election was the rise of the independent candidates. Tony Windsor and Rob Oakeshott have a lot to answer for both locally and federally for what they have done to politics in Australia. They have both gotten their 30 pieces of silver but it is the electorate that is paying the price.
Steve49
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules.
mummylady
I'm really disappointed in the government. I voted for them after much agonising over the Rudd debacle and am constantly frustrated by their lack of regard for the voters. Money spent on 'Boat people' is phenomenal and could be better spent on our hospitals. The Carbon Tax when ppeople can't afford to pay energy bills as it is and free set top boxes for pensioners- idiots they can't afford to turn telly on - what are they gonna do with a box???
SIMPLETON
Not entirely the present government has introduced certain legislation and have proposed new ones which are not to the voters liking - They have an atrocious record regarding the illegal & asylum seekers - They are allowing all sorts to enter this country and will ultimately create an umbalance in the overall population - They should learn from the European country who are now facing untold problems - It has lowered the level of civilisation western civilisation - Being politically correct is not to the benefit of the population it is used to the Australian detriment. Will they ever see the light ?
Liz
This government has been in for 4 years now -= bought us through a global recession =increased jobs and on the whole we are all better off (no work choices etc)...the old addage of "Rome wasn't built in a day" applies. In 12 years Howard did nothing for Health or Education, this government is in there doing their best and I personally think, doing a good job.
<
Most businesses are geared up for the Carbon Tax and let's face it....someone has got to start somewhere..... Why when Abbot says anything, everyone believes him (without any evidence) and when our P.Msays something everyone jumps all over her without waiting to see what is going to be brought in. All Abbots figures and statements are NOT based on fact they are fiction. So lets wait and see what happens..
errolsyd
This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules.
awsewell
You really think we are better off?
The only reason we got through the GFC unscathed was because the Howard/Costello government had us in a huge surplus. I don't think Abbott's doing a great job, in fact I think the only reason are showing the Labor Government as being close to the coalition in the polls is because of Abbott.
The Carbon tax is nothing more than a wealth redistribution system where again the money will be taken from the middle and high income earners and redirected towards low income earners and welfare recipients. It's all just another piece of the puzzle with the Labor party trying to implement a communist structure. The Labor party want to remove all incentives to work hard by penalising those who do in order to reward those who sit back and wait for handouts. As the taxes go up, workers demand more pay and the government brings in foreign workers who will work for peanuts. This leads to more unemployment, more need for welfare and further increases in taxes to maintain welfare costs. Once the baby boomers are all retired the Labor party's ideals will collapse.
CAT17
The comment regarding the result of our system of voting is so true. We vote with our concience (at least I do) and yet because of the way the preference are distributed we end up with either the wrong government from the one we voted for or a hung parliment which is frustrating to anyone who genuinly wants a government that will be good for all. I think we should not have compulsrary voting. Then we would have a true indication who should be in government. People vote for a "popular" solgan or person (Kevin 07 a good example) and look how that ended. Now with have the female ranga (red head) and where is she taking us! This government should be gotten rid of as soon as possible. Don't for
get the Greens are not the tree hugging people a lot thought they were.
mysteron347
Many years ago, a friend of mine objected to providing the Social Security department his EXACT income in order to claim a benefit. His point was that the legislation required only that he declare whether his income was above or below the limits set, and that SS should, if they doubted his declaration (that his income was below the limit) be able to get confirmation from the Tax Department as a simple "his declaration is/is not true."
Eventually, the minister determined that he had to declare his exact income as demanded because SS was entitled to ask any question they liked to determine eligibility. As it happens, this issue inflamed his relations with his wife, who insisted that he simply buckle under to the demand and was a trigger for their eventual divorce.
In my own situation, I found that a skill that I had had been place on the Migration Occupations Demand List (MODL.) I wrote to the minister, asking which companies had these alleged positions open, since I'd seen no advertisements in Australia for two years or more.
The minister's flunkie wrote back, sending me wads of information about how "these people fit in well with our society," effectively alleging that I was a racist. No information on who wanted these skills, of course.
In the first instance, the minister's response was "what is convenient." Suppose it was taken to the extreme, where any public servant could ask any question they liked of you before providing you with the service? Rather than simply agree that my friend was correct and the form should be changed, the minister gave the public service the green light to ask any kind of intrusive question.
In the second, it's simply taking anti-discrimination to the extreme, declaring anyone who objects to be racist and hence to be ignored.
So underlying all this is the democratic process itself. The politicians ARE listening - but to the LOUDEST voices, the proverbial empty barrels. These people can be relatively easily identified. They believe that 'debating' means mechanically naysaying every point against them, dreaming up a slogan to chant when their stock of arguments run out, and resorting to puerile name-calling when that falters.
Unfortunately, these people's votes count the same as any conscientiously considered vote. Is it any wonder why the politicians have made voting compulsory? They can rely on a tide of ignorance to swamp any dissent.
It's a logical fallacy to believe that government by consensus is intrinsically 'good' or 'fair.' It's simply convenient - by offending the fewest people, you minimise the chance of revolution.
19chris51
Yes you are right sigrew1, I don`t believe the Government is lisitening to us, I have written to several Ministers and high up people, but have had no reply,I`m certinally not winging, just stating some of my concerns, to no avail. I don`t however think it is just this Government, as the previous Government (Howard) did`nt answer either, I think it is alright for the people not in power to critise, but in power they just do what they want as well, we have no real person with backbone in this country, Labor nor Liberal coalition.
Anyway, my main gripe is the boat people, they come out here with no papers (throw them overboard, it is a fact) and then complain that it takes so long to process them, well hello, they don`t seem to understand how long it takes to try and communicate with the countries they have come from, its a long arduous process (LONG,LONG,LONG) and it does not help when they destroy Government buildings in the pocess, and certinally does not enhance them to the majority of Australians,Villawood is a detention Centre, the facilities are reasonable, (I saw inside these buildings when they where still a Migrant Hostel) infact these facilities have improved sinced then. Send the trouble makers BACK, we have enough trouble now,
The climate is definatly changing, caused by MAN or NATURAL, it is happening, carbon tax, not too sure, is it just "Revenue"? not sure again, but it is changing.
Parsimony
Interesting collection of replies you have so far.
I wonder which voters views are not being reflected?
We are in a unique position where there is a hung parliament where the government is dependant on the support of minority parties and independants. This means that the suite of policies they went to the election with is not something they can fully deliver unless these same minority parties and independants support the policies. In almost every case they do not support all of what the government is proposing and therefore the government has to negotiate a lesser or different position. This the reality of a minority government.
I am puzzled about what some people are against in regards to a Carbon tax as it is quite clear that the details of this policy have not been articulated yet. Unfortunately this means for some people ignorance is bliss and that the absence of the policy details does not mean that this stops them arguing what will be in the policy detail.
As far as immigration this is a mess but with the number of different conflicts in our world it is not surprising that people want to come to Australia. As far as people entering Australia illegally the vast majority arrive on planes not boats. That doesnt mean that illegal arrivals are not a problem but a boat people headline is much easier and simpler than Qantas arrivals.
Taxation I recall is going to be discussed at a summit later this year when all the material from the Henry report will be debated.
This is not the best government we have ever had but it is a direct product of what we the voters chose at the last election and minority governments are always complex, frastrating and difficult.
Opa
Parsimony,you confuse people with logic! It's so much easier to just shout negative slogans,when you don't have a credible alternative to present. I concede that the present Government has had many failures since they have been elected,but the other side has nothing to offer but negativity
Ollie
Parsimony regardless of which political party I support, I actually like your argument.
It is a much more positive and informative piece than many who just choose to whinge and criticize.
The many issues that governments deal with are always complex, for one size does not fit all. I understand the personal fear, and perhaps hip pocket mentality, when we see the cost of necessities soaring daily!
I am retired, ageing and unable to work again, so have limited income. I focus on the simple and inexpensive things in life, yet basics such as food, warmth, electricity & gas supplies are sky rocketing. It really is very, very scary.
Any government that has no vision or empathy, will never adequately compensate the strugglers, for they are too arrogant to bother to know how it is for some people...(they ensure they have a more than adequate pension entitlement).
errolsyd
Hi Cat 17, Well the tale goes on and it appears no one in goverment is listening to the MAJORITY of Aussies as we are raceists whose opinion is not worth listening to. Programme the other night gave the % of boat people on welfare and unemployed If I remember correctly it was above 60% and less than 30% spoke english after several years. With over 12000 boat people arriving since 2009 with more arriving every week no wonder the goverment has trouble balancing the books. After the influx of ILLEGALS from 1999-2001 approx 12000, the number from 2002-2008 was reduced to only 449 by Howards government so there is only one area to blame for this rise and that, SURPRISE is brown/gillards so called goverment. They do not give a rats about our own people who have paid their taxes only to see them wasted under this so called labor party. The founders of the Australian Labor Party would hide their heads in shame if they could see what now uses their name.
grhmwlsn
Not true 'dingdong' The ALP received, according to the AEC, almost 200,000 more first preference votes than the Conservative coalition. Abbott, when he thought they had more votes tried to use that as a coercion over the independents as a big hammer on them to suggest he was 'more' entitled to their support. You might also remember he said that he often does not 'tell the truth' and only what he has written down can be considered what he means.
As for the carbon tax it is a must. Big polluters must pay for the continuing and future problems caused by their pollution. Whay sort of a 'air' are we leaving for our children and grandchildren?
CAT17
Your comments are spot on, this Gillard government are not what we voted for, in fact Labor was voted OUT. Every time I read about another massive amount of money going off shore to some foreign country to aid them in their crisis my blood boils. There is so much hardship and crisis in this country at the moment and yet nothing is being done. The money donated by the people dosen't seem to be getting to those who need it. Why is it taking so long to get people back to some normality. People who lost everything in the bush fires are still waiting, communities are still shattered. This government has borrowed so much money to finance their crazy schemes (pink bats, school halls etc) that it will take generations to clear the debt. You're right about the ones arriving by plane they do have papers ((not always their own ofcourse) but the boat arrivals have none, so tell me how do they claim to have family already living here when there is no proof who they are? Those who rioted and caused so much damage will no doubt be rewarded with visas just like the ones were who would not get off the boat 2 years ago until they got assurance they would be brought to the mainland. I wonder how many of them were genuine refergees? Yet another big "balls up" by this goverrnment. Bowen is a weak Minister and always seems to talk tough but talk is all he does. Australia is heading for disaster and a very divided population.
Parsimony
Dingodan,
We have minority governments and coalitions simply because no single party has enough votes in enough seats to get a majority in the lower house.
If you look at the recent history of our federal governments we have had only one in recent history where they have had a majority in both houses. Every other government had to make deals, mainly in their senate to get legislation through, this one has to make deals in both houses.
If the LCP or the LNP got the support of the independants they would still have to make deals in both houses as they too would not have a majority in either house. They may or may not be better but they would be facing the same dilemma of not having the numbers.
dingodan
So Parsimony thinks we have the Government we voted for ? . The only reason we have this incompetent bunch is the preferential deals done with the Greens .We should never have Preferences as it ensures Majority voting means nothing ! . The LCP Coalition had about half a million more first preferences .
Parsimony
Errolsyd,
You seem to be covering a vast range of topics and referring to a number of governments rather than just one.
Let me start where you finished - people arrive in Australia by plane and can immediately claim refugee status - unlike the TV shows they do not get sent straight back. Many more arrive with papers as you correctly state but then many of these overstay. The vast bulk of people who are or become illegal entries to this country do not come by boat. The simplistic view portrayed by our simplistic politicians and unenquiring media is that we are awash with boat people when they are not the bulk of arrivals. The idea of lets not get the facts get in the way of a good story seems king. What no oneseems to realise is that every single person who arrives illegally or becomes illegal after they arrive, if they end up being able to stay legally takes a place off the total number of immigrants that we take each year.
I do not want to be seen to defend politicians and don't as I get ample opportunity to criticise them first hand but when you talk about government housing, unless you are talking about defence housing, this is a state or territory responsibility. Similarly dental care and hospitals are state or territory responsibilities even though they use some federal funds. The feds fund medicare for GP rebates.
Similarly the flood and bushfire recovery are state or territory responsibilities again even though they get access to some federal money.
The whole federal state territory system seems designed to confuse people and ensure that no one is responsible for anything as they can always try and blame someone else.
As i think I said in my post, this is not our best (federal) government but minority governments are always difficult and we have got what we voted for.
The proposed carbon tax is another classic example where I keep on hearing what people will be charged a for carbon, who will be compensated and how much they will be compensated when there are no details of the scheme yet. I would be happy to try and explain the scheme if there was material avaiable to do so rather than people speculating and trying to get a headline.
errolsyd
Pray tell Parsimony, sorry I cannot think of one thing this goverment has got right. Can anyone tell me how we reduce our carbon footprint by charging big companies a carbon tax then compensating some of them, they put up their prices to us then julia partially compensates us. All I can see from this is another great goverment dept to handle this which will only increase the pollution? Don't get me started on the ILLEGAL boat people, pink bats, handing out OUR money hand over fist to places like indonesia while flood/bushfire victims are still living in tents , c/vans and we have a health system in crisis through lack of money and forethought. If you require more doctors and nurses you have to train them ,which we fail to do because lack of money in the budget.
Why do OUR people who are not fortunate enough to be able to afford necessary things in life have to wait so long for goverment housing, dental and medical treatment. Why no money spent of OUR so called National Highway that gets cut every time we have a shower of rain? But through all this our pollies grandstand and give away billions to countries when most of it goes to corrupt goverment officials. Please explain? p.s. at least the arrivals by Qantas come with papers, for those without they do not get out of the airport.
CAT17
This current government is disartrous! They have wasted billions on "projects" that have really done nothing to improve Australia.The builders of the School Halls that charged inflated prices (buildings costed way above the real cost) did ok, Installers of pink bats( that have caused fires even deaths) did ok. So many bats were never installed and claims were paid to bogus installers. Four young men died during the insulation frenzie as they were not trained, and now even more money is being spent to have every insulation checked to ensure the houses are safe. Millions are being spent on accommodation for "asylum seekers" in fact more than any amount that is spent on our homeless - that dosen't seem to worry the government .If you voted for this government you have surely been let down just as much as those of us who did not. In fact they aren't the government that was voted in, they made "deals" with the Independents (who sold out for their own benefit). Labor has always been big spenders and when the country is in massive debt (which is happening again with this lot) the taxpayers have to bare the brunt of rising costs so that the Budget can be brought back to surplus. I know they aren't listening to the voters as I feel Australia will never recover from the disastrous decisions they have made. Carbon tax will not help the planet in any way, it will just cost the man in the street more for everthing. While we are dealing with yet another riot in a detention centre the PM is having a great time overseas!! Fancy her even travelling away during the most religeous event celebrated by Christians in Australia. I guess when you are an atheist Easter would not mean anything to you.
Anonymous
Carbon tax will push uyp the cost of living and those people in the greatest need will not be compensated enough
mauvehaze
So true.
gabesmate
I really don't think they are being dishonest. In fact I'm inclined to think that all political parties try really hard to do what is best for the country. Love them or hate them, they are a necessity. Have been interested in politics always, and think that the present situation in federal politics is completely fascinating. All parties are on a knife edge. As things are I am certain we will get the most complely fair situation that has ever existed in Aust. federal politics. I wonder if Kevin Rudd will be made leader of the Labour Party again. Now that would be really interesting.
gabesmate
I really don't think they are being dishonest. In fact I'm inclined to think that all political parties try really hard to do what is best for the country. Love them or hate them, they are a necessity. Have been interested in politics always, and think that the present situation in federal politics is completely fascinating. All parties are on a knife edge. As things are I am certain we will get the most complely fair situation that has ever existed in Aust. federal politics. I wonder if Kevin Rudd will be made leader of the Labour Party again. Now that would be really interesting.
MTD
Fact is , sadly, that politicians only worry about the next 3-5 years, to the next election, even if it is not good for the people or land.
Eugine
Collecting money won't help the atmosphere at all but growing more trees and saving our forests will. Why do they think that burning our coal overseas is preferable to burning it here?. The fuel used carting our minerals overseas and then carting the products back to Australia will do more damage to the atmosphere than manufacturing the products here . Destroying our good agricultural land doesn't seem to bother our politicians at all. Forget about future generations seems to be their view. No, they are not honest.
CAT17
We don't know for sure ofcourse, but just use your common sense if big companies are going to taxed who do you think will ultimately pay the cost? We will in everything we do, buy and use. Don't listen to politics, use your own sense and read between the lines (lies)!
MandMm
I remember hearing someone mention that the government is considering a $10 a week elctricity allowance for certain allowance receivers. Yes, this will reduce the impact of the costs on the peopel receiving this allowance, but it's really just promoting or encouraging the companies to charge as much as they want, and not look for a more cost effective way to provide these services. I think the money should be invested in buying shares in electricity companies, so we have some mroe control over them. Maybe put in some more legislation to ensure that costs don't go up so dramatically or something?
MTD
Not only Abbot says that,
Also the current Coalition (read minority Labor Govt) They say we will compensate you for the extra costs, but won't (or are unable to) tell you whether the billions they collect will reduce the gasses even a fraction of 1%.
It just shows up the dishonesty of ALL politics that are being imposed upon the population.
fehowarth
Kenny how do you know that? Just because Mr. Abbott say something, that does not make it true.