Windows 7 pricing
Posted by: the_dr
27th Oct 2009 11:50pm
I was looking online just after Windows 7 can someone explain the why in Australia we are paying close to 100% more than US Before you saying exchange rate at the time the Australian dollar was at 0.92 USD Australia USA * Home Premium $199 $119 * Professional $399 $199 * Ultimate $429 $219
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Comments 31
Steve49
We have to pay too much for everything in Australia
lucaswestlund
Fair question. USA always seem to get everything faster and at a lower price than in other countries. I believe software products are overpriced especially windows which leads to illegal downloads..
lpullman
Downloading software is in no way illegal. That's the line the software and movie industries would like you to accept. It is a lie.
Use of the downloaded software MAY be a breach of a license agreement. That is a civil matter not criminal. That's why they sue a few peer-to-peer users rather than prosecute.
The license agreement may also be in breach of local consumer protection laws. Most attempt to supercede the statutory warranty provisions we have in Australia for a start. I've found the words "fit for purpose" a wonderful stick to beat vendors with (yes, I'm looking at you Canon).
As for faster and cheaper, well DOH! The USA is (or rather was) the largest heterogenous market so of course stuff gets released there first. A lot of goods are also traded in US dollars so everyone else is at a disadvantage.
However, if you've ever been to the more advanced parts of Asia you'll know that there is a vast amount of stuff that goes on sale there first.
Calnino
Slow day in the office alfielee?
It's all very good to be a Linux zealot, however are you going to offer to support all those "average" users who switch over to a Linux variant?
It may be easier to use Linux now than 2 years ago, however it still doesn't just work out of the box everytime, and it's a lot harder to troubleshoot for the average user than Windows is.
lpullman
As a tech I can tell you that the reason you Windows box works so well is because people like me work very hard to make it so. Try doing it all from scratch some time - install the OS, find all the necessary hardware drivers, install them, configure, etc. On the other hand Ubuntu does "just work" out of the box. It is my goto for when I need a quick setup.
The only gotcha is when you run into some cheapo Windows-only hardware. Someone already mentioned modems (beware of winmodems) and I'll add cheapo GDI laser printers.
As for ease of use, I can't say I see any difference between Ubuntu and Windows post XP. Macs I find incredibly frustrating to do anything useful. I usually resort to the terminal and treating it like a *nix system anyway. Generally troubleshooting is easier on a Linux box 'cause they tend to log stuff obsessively and tell you what is wrong. Assuming you know where to look, of course! Windows problems tend to be more obscure and less well documented. Windows also suffers from a lot more trivial issues that aren't really problems so much as misconfiguration.
The average user can troubleshoot neither.
alfielee
One of the real problems we face here in Oz is that everything we import is priced up for our market. We need to make it clear to the impostors (importers) that we're sick of being ripped off. Buy your software over the web & buy your mobiles over the web from overseas. We pay more than double what the US pay for mobile phones.
We are ripped off by overseas companies because we don't use Hong Kong or China to buy our goods. We are just ripped off by these a-holes.
As far as Windows is concerned, the best way to get them to reduce their charge here is to give them the impression you would rather use open-source software. Just forgetting my continuous argument that states that Linux is better anyway, it is free & Microsoft cannot bear that Linux is taking so much of their consumer ground away from them. That is the reason they produced a version of Windows to run on a netbook, to compete with Linux. If you have an older computer with a wireless or wired network, just try it out & let your computer supplier know that you are trying out Linux. The more people that do this, the more Windows will drop their prices to compete to keep their customer base. If you have 2 or more computers at home & one is hardly used then what are you going to lose by trying Linux?
lpullman
Actually, they produced the cut down version of 7 because they wanted to take XP Home into End Of Life. Nothing to do with Linux, it was XP Home that OEMs were installing on netbooks. Personally I need XP Pro for the networking and security so I had to "upgrade" with some registry hacking to make it think it was the Pro version.
Otherwise I agree with you Linux comments. For what 50% of users want (a web terminal) Linux is perfect.
As an aside - if you are use Internode for your ISP they have local mirrors of several distros which are unmetered downloads. If you grab the net install ISOs for either Debian or Ubuntu you can install directly from their mirror. Works and treat and doing it on a laptop over wireless while sitting outiside on the verandah drinking gin and lime is very geek cool.
alfielee
Try Ubuntu instead. Download it for nothing or buy a Linux magazine with Ubuntu on the DVD. Install it on an old computer until you're ready to use Linux. It is more secure, has far fewer malware affecting it, has far more features than Windows anything & is free. Use 3G, wireless networking, ADSL & a range of basic to incredible desktops with various desktops to choose from.
Btw, we pay more than double for mobiles compared to the US.
nomad
Instead of whinging about prices, why don't you shop around and get the best deal. We got it from Harvey Norman and they weren't to badly priced, compared to elsewhere we thought they were reasonally priced. If your that worried about the difference in price buy it from the us then.
ayu
possible causes:
1.lack of competition in Australian market
2. We have much more Microsoft windows user are much more popular than Mac user
alfielee
MACs are more expensive than Windows. What are you talking about? How does moving to MAC make anything cheaper. They compete with M$ on prettiness, not price. If you want to make Windows cheaper more people need to use Linux. Try Ubuntu for a download cost only or buy a magazine, Linux or Linux Format & use the attached DVD to install. Try it on an older computer first so that you can see how good it is. Use wireless, ADSL, 3G for the system but not dial-up which generally using an internal modem doesn't work. All the software you use costs you nothing & the experience will make you a better computer user.
Mick
Not only are we paying too much, but here are no multi-user licences across all versions. So if you have multiple machines that you want to install W7 on, you need to get ripped off again and again for an individual copy for each unit.
And these people wonder why consumers turn to pirated copies of this software.
lpullman
Not really sure what you mean. Windows is licensed per device so of course you have to buy a license for each computer.
I'll repeat what I've said earlier but with a little more force: in place upgrades are for mugs. Don't buy Windows in a box, buy it with a system. There is no reason apart from gotta-have-the-latest fetishism to upgrade.
People turn to pirated software for a large range of reasons - avoiding the hassles of license management systems is the most ironic. I seriously doubt that a desire to install it on every computer in sight is much of a contributor.
For reference: written on a Windows XP Pro system still happily chugging along.
alfielee
Try Ubuntu instead. You can download it for free & stop giving M$ & the USA so much of our money.
lpullman
OK, I work in the IT industry and we sell Windows 7 so I figure I'm qualified to comment on this:
The short answer is because they can. MS have a concept of comparative cost: you charge less in markets where people get paid less. Check out the UK and Malaysian prices if you don't believe me.
Having said that, I see that Officeworks are selling a 3 license Home Premium upgrade package for $247. That's about $85 a pop if you have three systems you want to upgrade.
The exchange rate has very little to do with it. These products are come into the country in bulk at a pre-arranged cost to the importer. Shipping will be a bigger cost factor than the exchange rate. It takes about three months for product to make it's way through channel - this is based on how long it took our suppliers to run out of Office 2003 OEMs after they went end-of-life. In the case of a new release, they will stockpile a month or so ahead (that's why some of us had market release version of Windows 7 several weeks ahead of the retail channel)
The price difference between the USA and here is down to what MS think the market will bare. A quick look at one of our suppliers says the difference between our cost price and RRP is 10% and 8% for the Home Premium and Pro upgrades respectively. I know from talking to our suppliers that they are making similar or lower margins all the way back to MS. So to those claiming stores are ripping them off, please go apologise to your local PC shop.
Our supliers don't even list full retail products, which brings me to my final point:
I just checked out accounts system and we haven't sold a boxed Windows product in the last financial year. This confirms my gut reaction is that no one but a mug buys an operating system over the counter. The smart way is to buy an OEM version with a new system.
Pricing for OEM (ie not for retail sale) versions from us are:
Home Basic $132
Home Premium $176
Professional $209
The sharp eyed amongst you will have noted that this is pretty much the same as upgrade pricing in the US in US$. We don't list upgrade or boxed products because no one buys them.
So my advice is: if you really want Windows 7, go down to your local computer store - not one of the big chains, support your local businesses - and ask what hardware you need to buy to get an OEM. Generally, it's a HDD or a motherboard, some will settle for RAM and some will do a dodgy and just sell you the damn thing. Slap that new HDD in and do a new install - I learnt years ago that upgrades lead to nothing but trouble. Or buy it preinstalled on a new system (again from your local store - it's people like you who keep local business going; every time you buy from a big chain you take money away from your friends and neighbours)
So for the executive summary: no one really buys retail boxed full products so who cares what the supposed price is. Upgrade versions are for mugs and the desperate, so again who cares what they cost. The only version smart people buy is OEM which is reasonably priced from the 5 minutes research I've just done.
lpullman
Wierd, I can find Veritons listed but not the 7200. Only one I can find is several years old. I hate it when venors reuse model numbers. DG41 chipset sounds right for the age...
Glad you have an XP disc - far more useful than recovery media.
Missing NTLDR (I presume that's what you meant) means the Windows bootloader is missing. You can fix this using a Windows install disc without losing you data. Most common cause is a corrupted boot sector. If it happens repeatedly I'd replace the HDD (which is what you did). It's a bugger to troubleshoot because it could be caused by many things and if it only happens intermittently...
Windows 7 is about as different to XP as Ubuntu Linux in my opinion.
If you are still curious get an Ubuntu CD (DVD now I think?) - you can boot from that and run the OS without affecting what is on the HDD. It gives you a chance to see what it's all about without making the committment of installing the OS. You can get the disc from the cover of numerous magazines, download a disc image (see it your ISP has an unmetered mirror: on Internode it's mirror.internode.on.net and on Bigpond it's mirror.aarnet.edu.au) or get one from you local Linux Users Group.
The original topic seems to be pretty much dead or at least flogged out.
Proteus
Hmm...sorry is a veriton 7200 pro version, black case. Only purchased 18 month ago new from local pc store...Has 4 gig ram, processor is 2.3ghz. I still have the original acer board sitting here after I had the new one installed ...intel dg41rq. I'm not really a tech head sorry. Yep would have to agree with you about Acer, they have given me nothing but a run around and I'm not recomending their products to anyone! The prob when it crash black screen with the words miss LTDR. After reinstalling winxp pro with the serial on the side of the pc, all good again ...but I'm still fearful it might just do it again. I cannot affortd to get a new system unfortunately, so I guess I'm stuck with this lemon. Was just looking at the invoice for it to be honest ,,,,purchased 11th jan 2008. Sigh....I know linux is a whole new ballgame, and I'm cautious about going there as I'm not keen on trying to learn a new way of doing things just now, so I thought win 7 woould have been the best option.
Cer's recovery disks by the way, well I made em of course, asked me for four cd's or one dvd....I did both methods ...and yet when it came to have to use them, well I got to disk four, and it asked me for disk 5?? When I used the dvd, well, it told me it as incomplete. So much for Acer and their backup/restore systems. I do have a copy of xp pro and it does install and accept my license number so I guessthat is a blessing in itself.
Anyway thanks for your input, sorry we digressed from the original topic.
Cheers
lpullman
Acer aren't exactly my favourite vendor and they are sinking to the level of Dell on warranty service. This is why we get systems built locally by someone we trust to do it right the first time. I costs a little more but we get to control what goes in at client sites and we have someone to go yell at when something goes wrong :-)
When you say "lost the OS" do you mean failed to detect the HDD, found the HDD but no boot track or started booting Windows and then failed with a blue screen?
I just looked the Veriton 7200 spec up and it looks pretty old to me. Blue and white case? Pentium 4 somewhere between 1.5 and 2GHz? Acer list Windows 2000 and 98SE as OS options, so I think this is more than 18 months old. Acer reckon it's a socket 478 board and I haven't been able to source them for at least 2 years (which annoys me 'cause theres 3 perfectly good 2.4GHz socket 478 CPUs sitting on the workshop shelf we could be using) My recolleciton is they were end of life around 4 years ago, replaced by the socket 775 boards. The only stock left was from covering warranties.
My real concern about the spec is it only lists a 200W supply, which is well under rated for a modern PC or even a 1.5GHz P4. If you've got a gig of RAM in there you'd easily be pushing its limits. That could very well be killing motherboards and causing your HDD problems. The sad thing is that a replacement 500W PS should cost under $60, assuming the Acer case will take a standard unit.
Acer, like most of the big vendors, don't supply media. They expect you to make a recovery disc that will set the system back to virgin. Not a lot of use for fixing OS problems unfortunately. You are better off copying a mate's disc or downloading and buring an image. You've got a valid serial number and that will work with any copy of the right version.
I'm guessing that most of you software would run under Windows 7, but I'm also certain that upgrading the OS will not fix your problems. Also remember that Vista and Windows 7 NEED at least 2Gb of RAM to work well. I know MYOB v12 and v19 work fine on Windows 7 - I have customers doing it. I think one runs 11 as well. Most of the problems with older software is down to the programme wanting to write files somewhere it shouldn't (like the Windows directory) and Windows 7 gets around that quite well.
Linux on the other hand will be a whole new ball game. Some of your software MIGHT work under WINE, but I know MYOB premiere 12 won't 'cause I've tried.
My advice is stick with XP until you come to replace the computer (which by sound of it will not be any time soon!) and then get whatever is on offer.
Proteus
Hmm...as far as MYOB goes, I'm using Premier 12, and licensed,,,as far as the OS on the pc, yep software also licensed ( sticker on the side ) and the pc itself is only 18 month old.. Acer Veriton 7200. Acer replaced motherboard not three months after purchase, replace hd four months after purchase, and then it kept losing the os - so it kept going back and back to them for repairs.. Even the recovery cd's would not work when it crashed, and Acer would not give me the cd to reinstall windows xp pro on it either. To make a long sad tale short - it crashed once too often and I was told it was again (from Acer) the motherboard. I had this replaced myself with a better board, had everything else thoroughly checked and away it went again - as did my acer warranty of course.
I again lost the os a few weeks ago, reinstall of the os, and again it is fine. I'm still wondering about the win 7 side of it..and also the linux side, but again it gets back to my programmes and the compatability - which most of them are not compat with either win 7 or linux :( bugger....
So here I am again, with a practically brand new pc again , apart from the power supply, and after the monies I've spent I'm not gong to be changing that.
Reading more about win 7, I'm led to believe that some of my programmes will run under the "xp mode" but I'm still not sure. So as you read, I'm in a quandry and stuck in a hard place just now. Bloody technoligy is supposed to make life easier, but hey, not in my case lately :( grrrrr. LOL
All the tech's I been too here (qualified ones) are at a loss at to why I'm having probs, so I guess I just have to keep on keeping on for now.
Sorry to go on at length, but I'm getting frustrated with it all now.
Cheers
lpullman
Does your accounting software run under WINE? My last test of MYOB was a partial failure - don't ask why: if it had worked it would have been genius, but it didn't. If not the a swap to Linux would be far more problematic than a Windows upgrade.
Does your PC have a license sticker on it? If so that's the bit you paid for. The sticker will tell you which version you need. You can scrounge a copy from a mate or download it.
Sounds like you have bigger problems than the OS version. I support, oh off the top of my head, a couple of hundred PC. 90% running Windows XP, only two are a consistent problem and both are caused by third part software installed by the user(s). My point being that Windows XP is a mature and stable product. If you look at the DHCP logs in our office you'll find that the XP boxes get restarted once a week on average.
I doubt your problems will be fixed by an OS upgrade.
What sort of problems are you having? Clearly they aren't motherboard or HDD related. A motherboard failing in service is pretty rare these days, let alone multiple times. I'd be changing board manufacturers and replacing the power supply if that is the case. Actually, you'd be amazed at how many hardware problems are caused by cheapo power supplies.
What you were told by your vendors is the official position. Many will bend the rules to make a sale or keep the customer happy. Try another store, someone will do it for you. And don't buy the HDD first, the hardware has to be on the same invoice as the OS.
I wouldn't worry about support for XP vanishing any time soon. There is still a huge installed base in corporate customers. Unlike consumers, corporates are very conservative: when they get something to work, they can support it and it's a know quantity they are extremely loathe to move on. The reason Vista was such a failure was the lack of take up by business customers. Windows 7 is faring better, but the corporates that I deal with are only just evaluating it. They've rolled out office 2007 (mostly) but Windows 7 is at very least months from general deployment.
All of which is to say that MS cannot afford to abandon XP in the immediate future. My guess is there is at least 3 years left in this beast.
Proteus
Hmm, well after all the drama's I've had recently with my pc, new motherbaoard again, new hdd's again, and still getting a problems with win xp, after these purchases??
Come to think of it - where is my oem for win? Hmmm.
Went into my local pc store - not a big chain store, and did what you suggested (bought a new hd and ask about the oem etc.,) and was basically told, sorry, it is only available when you buy a complete system.
So, off to one of the chain stores, and tried again - same response. So for now, I'm staying with winxp, despite my pc problems and despite the fact the at I;m led to believe that support for xp wil end in 2011. It is frustrating to say the least, as I also am unsure about win7 because I am also having to udate several accounting programmes whihc will cost a lot of $$'s as they are not compatable. This is another point many users haven't considerd when looking at win 7 - but as you said, MS have got us all by the short and curlies. Maybe I should just dump MS altogether and go linux.?
Proteus
Yep I agree that Windows 7 is way overpriced, especially for the "upgrade".
I too would be shopping around before I even thought aout updating from Win XP sorry. An even if I did find a price for the version of Win7 that I wanted, I still don't think I will be updating for at least another 12months as there are too many little problems with it, ie, printer drivers not available for many models, and a few other things I have found from friends that have upgradedt to the new version.
Razorfish
Be careful - Australian retailers are ripping consumers off. The prices you found from the US and the prices Microsoft recommends for a retail price (or near enough). If you want Window 7 then shop around. I just the OEM version from gamedude.com in QLD for $160 (professional).
lpullman
Aussie retailers are NOT ripping off customers. See my long post below for some actual info about what sort of margins retailers are making.
GoBears
No reason besides maybe pure greed and lack of competition here. Guess it's a similar scenario to overpricing groceries, banking, petrol, telcos, public transport, rates, housing... oh I once heard a rumour that we were the lucky country. It's what's been happening all along.. they're pulling the wool over our eyes.
danno j
i agree - thye wool over our eyes..thinking back..the rot set in from the time the Australian $ was floated,and the Australian financial institutions were de-regulated..yeah! - that'll work..NOT!! ...WE WORK LONGER FOR LESS..WHY? - MOSTLY TO DO WITH "PUBLIC COMPANIES" - SHAREHOLDERS;SALARIES OF THE SO CALLED "EXPERTS @ THE TOP...
chickenman
prices are so high because the sellers know that people will buy, no matter what the price.
alfielee
Unfortunately if you are running Vista then an upgrade is probably a necessity because of the time-wasting & the incompatibilities. Try Linux for nothing other than a but of time. Anybody who tells you Linux isn't a practical choice hasn't used Linux in the last 2 years. Linux has come a long way over the past few years & wireless works better than Windows now, 3G works brilliantly, many printers that didn't work now work, scanners, webcams etc.
From a desktop perspective, Windows & MAC only dream of being as versatile as Linux is & always has been. Only now it's easier than ever. The choice of desktop management systems depends on simply choice or the capacity of computer you are using. Even so each computer from netbook to desktop have variety to choose from. The prettiness & fun-stuff the desktop can achieve are from completely basic to unbelievably better than what Windows or MAC can achieve. Depends on you & your computer'(s) hardware, not how much you have to pay.
alfielee
Actually everything electronic we buy here is priced up. Mobile phones are more than double what they pay in the US.
jayenmelb
Simply the Global Financal Crisis and what companies think they can get away with. America is woeful at the moment in consumer spending hence huge discounts on everything from cars to computers. Different story in financially stable Oz. Anyone knows if you just wait a year after the release of any new gizmo the price will fall. Windows 7 is not a 'must have' critical operating system and the private and business world will continue to use XP which seems, despite everything Microsoft would like to do to keep rolling in its dollars, the acceptable and nicely working system we're all very happy with.
purpleprincess
good question. I believe that we are all wondering the same thing. How are we suppose to keep up-to-date when it costs us so much more?